ESL Writers Forum: July 2008

Interview: Yoko Nishikawa

Yoko Nishikawa is Senior Correspondent for Political and General News, Japan, at Reuters News Agency’s Tokyo bureau. She was born in Tokyo in 1971. When she was in the ninth grade she won a scholarship to study in the United States. After graduating from high school she enrolled at Georgetown University where she earned an undergraduate degree. She was first hired by the British news organization as a trainee in 1996. She quit six years later to pursue a graduate degree at the Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies. She was rehired by Reuters in 2004 as a senior correspondent for economic policy and has held her current position since October 2008.

Our interview took place in September 2008 as the financial meltdown in the United States was taking place. At the time of our interview, Yoko Nishikawa was the head of the economic policy team at Reuters.

Writers Forum

What made you decide to attend university in the States as opposed to Japan?

Yoko Nishikawa

Well, I actually was very homesick during my high school time. Although I missed Japan, I was kind of wondering whether I should go back to Japan for college or stay in the States. I got into some schools in the U.S., but still I was not sure. So I came back (to Japan) for a year and wondered whether I should go to yobiko (cram school for university entrance exams.) But I just couldn’t find any appealing university in Japan, so I decided to go to Georgetown.

Big decision. Especially for someone who hadn’t spent her formative years in the States. Very big decision!

Actually, I was young enough to do that (laughs).

What did you major in at Georgetown?

International Relations, Politics, and Organization.

When did you start thinking about journalism as a career? Was that while you were still in school?

I don’t remember exactly. I was always curious about a job or career in journalism, but I think I made up my mind around junior or senior year of university.

What was it that attracted you to journalism?

I thought that the media has such a huge power. Yes policy makers do make policy, but media has such an influence. It’s such a privilege to be able to meet people and talk about what’s happening in the world. Actually, at first, I was thinking about a different focus from what I’m doing now. My first ambition was to go outside Japan and report on the poor, on conflicts, on war.

The developing world.

Emerging, developing world. And see how their lives are evolving. Some people are in misery due to war, due to conflict. A lot of people are forgotten. Living in Japan, I just wanted to make sure their voices were heard. I haven’t done it yet, but that is my ultimate goal…

That was the spark…

Yes!

…that was driving you. You’re reporting on finance now, which seems very far removed. Do you still feel like you’re moving toward reporting about developing countries as your eventual goal?

I hope so. I have been expressing my desire to go outside Japan. Now I’m totally into financial news. Reuters is such a huge organization. It has the biggest number of bureaus in the world, of any news organization. So the opportunities are there. It’s up to me.

To navigate, to find your way through. When you were hired in 1996 did you start out in Finance?

Well, first I was a kind of a trainee, so I did a lot of different things. I did some currency market reporting, and then moved to an economic policy reporting team. In the beginning, trainees are asked to do all sorts of things. I actually worked on what at that point was a new project – putting news on the web site. I did that project for about 10 months.

What do you enjoy about financial reporting?

It’s…I didn’t know about it until I joined this company, how huge the markets are, and how quickly things actually move. It’s just so amazing. You don’t see what’s happening, you just see prices going up on the screen.

You’re covering the financial scene at a momentous time. The New York Times said that the changes underway now (Merrill Lynch, Lehman Brothers, and others, declaring bankruptcy) are “reshaping the landscape of American finance.”

When I first started covering financial policy, it was overwhelming.

Overwhelming in terms of…

Overwhelming in terms of how things move so quickly. During the Asian financial crisis, I didn’t know enough to stay on top of it. I was always trying to catch up with what was happening. That was exciting, in a way. It’s hard, it’s challenging, but exciting too.

What influenced your decision to write in English as opposed to your native Japanese?

I guess I wanted to…since I got to speak English when I studied abroad, I wanted to take advantage of that. And also, if you’re writing in English, your views go global.

There are fewer Japanese speakers in the world than English.

Yeah, you don’t have to be an English native speaker, it’s an international language.

So you’ve got a huge audience.

And it’s always challenging to write about Japan in English so that people who don’t know about Japan can understand better what’s happening here.

Can you give an example of something you feel proud of – perhaps a particular story, or a certain aspect of Japanese culture that you’ve been able to explain in a way that non-Japanese could understand?

Everybody says that Japanese politics is so mysterious. Policy makers are so…vague that it’s hard to really understand what they’re trying to say. So it’s always a challenge. I guess it’s a constant challenge to make sure I can write a story to a broader audience. And that’s a big theme for Reuters, too. You have to write a story in a way that a person on the other side of the globe can understand what’s happening in Japan.

So there’s the technical aspect, the financial jargon that you need to demystify, but there’s also the whole “aimai” aspect of Japanese culture – the tendency in Japan to say things indirectly, or vaguely. So that must be…

That’s hard! Because I…

Even Japanese often don’t understand!

Yeah. And especially the politicians try to make it vague!

They specialize in that!

So…I mean, let’s say, “shoa ga nai.” Or... “Ikaga na mono ka” for example, I don’t know if you’re….

The second one I don’t know.

“Ikaga na mono ka" which means, like, it has a negative meaning of ‘I wonder if…this is right, or this is appropriate?’ But basically, that does not mean that that person has said, ‘This is inappropriate or undesirable’ but kind of raising the question of: ‘I wonder if that’s OK….’ or not. Basically saying that they are against that policy, against that decision. So that…whenever they say such a thing, it is very hard to translate. Because the English language is so different from Japanese language, as you know.

Yeah.

Especially like, if you hear something in Japanese, and then you have this nuance that you want to translate. It’s very hard to have that nuance in English. And, often times we just have to…you don’t use that quote, you paraphrase.

Right.

Explain what…they suggested, for example. Although Reuters is not really keen on interpreting too much about what policy makers say. But sometimes we have to.

Sure.

To do so, you have to know what’s happening.

To put it in context.

Exactly.

We were talking about your decision to write in English as opposed to Japanese, and that audience was a big factor. Writing in English, you have such a huge, international audience. But I’m wondering if there’s anything in the nature of the two languages that also influenced your decision (to write in English.) For example, we were talking about the “aimai” factor.

Sure

…of Japanese language. Was there anything there that drew you to writing in English?

Let me think. This didn’t really drive me to choose English, to write in English, but after doing this job I realized that a lot of articles in Japanese newspapers … that the rules of writing articles are so different. For example, they don’t source policy makers but will say ‘The government has decided…’ without quoting any sources. The rules of the game are very different from English-language newspapers. I kind of like that.

More…accountability?

Yes. And credibility. You have bylines. Not to show off but just to show the audience…that you are responsible for this article, and you’re comfortable with this information.

Right.

Sometimes you have to… protect your sources, we do that, too. But…the mentality is a little bit different from Japanese journalism, Japanese language journalism.

Another thing I wanted to ask you, although….really, you’ve never worked for a Japanese company, right? I was going to ask if there is anything culturally about working for, in this case, a British company that’s challenging or difficult.

It’s much easier for me to answer. I really like working for a foreign company in Japan. I’m still…I’m 37 and I’m already in a middle management position. They didn’t really care about how young I was, or about the woman factor. I never felt that I was a female reporter. My gender doesn’t matter.

And you don’t really have so many issues around seniority, do you?

No. I mean…we do, but…maybe 80 percent of the reporters in the newsroom are Japanese. Still…the culture is so different (from a traditional Japanese company.) You can speak so frankly to anyone, and I really enjoy that. Even in a modern Japanese company, it’s still hard to… plan your career.

A well-known Japanese expression teaches that “The protruding nail gets pounded down." I think part of what you’re saying is that you can feel much more free to be who you are without worrying about…getting ‘pounded down’ in some way.

Exactly. It’s a very open organization. I guess growing up in the U.S., I don’t think I can handle a very traditional Japanese way of working. You can’t go home until your boss goes home kind of thing. (laughs.) You can go home, but you feel bad for going home. Until your boss leaves the office.

As opposed to, do I have work to do, that I need to do?

Yeah, right. Or speaking up and trying to express your ideas. Taking initiative is welcomed rather than discouraged.

Your initial spark for going into journalism was the thought of covering third world or developing world issues, or disenfranchised peoples or cultures. What do you see yourself doing, say, in 10 years?

I hope I will be doing that. I do not know yet if that will happen, but I want to be…if everything goes well, I have some kids, I have my whole family living in…I don’t know, even Indonesia.

So actually living outside Japan.

I hope that would happen, but it’s not very easy to do.

Is there any way to….write about developing world issues in Japan?

In a way, yes, and I have been trying to do that by covering those subjects. Like development aid, ODA issues.

Right.

And I try to do that as much as I can. I covered a meeting on African development that happened earlier this year. But I cannot write about what’s happening in Africa or Vietnam, for example.

Sure.

Because they have reporters there.

Sure.

One good thing about being in Japan is that a lot of policy makers from everywhere, U.S., Europe, and also developing countries, come to meet policy makers here. So whenever they come I have interviews with them. So I have been writing about Africa, Asia, that kind of thing. And I try to do that as much as I can. I just did an interview last week with the ADB (Asian Development Bank) president who was here. He’s Japanese, so I’ve known him for a while, but we talked about Asia. So that’s good.

Where do you see the current economic crisis ending?

I wish I knew. Nobody knows. I think it’s going to take a while to get back to normal.

Do you think that’s possible – going back to whatever ‘normal’ was – especially, say, in the States?

I think so. Look what we went through in Japan. We call it the “Lost Decade.” It resembles what we saw in 1997, ’98. You know, you never thought a big bank in Japan would go bankrupt. We’re back to normal, economically. Of course, it’s not perfect now, but…

What are the biggest challenges, or hurdles with your job?

Of course writing in English is a challenge always. I read my colleagues’ stories written by native speakers. When I see a very good story written by my colleague, I wish I could write that way. Even though, I feel like I could never master the language as much as they have. I still feel more comfortable with Japanese. As a language. I still say Japanese is my first language. And that will never change. So it’s a challenge to be writing in English, but I like that challenge.

I’m teaching Japanese students to write in English, so I see the challenges from a teacher’s perspective. Can you recall, especially that period back in Georgetown, when you were writing academic papers on a much larger scale than what you were doing in high school, what were the earliest challenges of being able to write in English?

I think it was just, at that time, it was not just writing, but it’s more understanding about the subject. For example, theology. I had to take theology at Georgetown. And because the subject was not familiar to me, I had to read like 100 pages for homework, and I just couldn’t catch up with it. Also, you had to express your opinions in class. And that was different from sitting in class and listening to teachers. More debate is required for schools in the U.S. and it was very difficult to adjust to that. I started learning English in Junior High School, just like everybody else. I went to the States after a few years of junior high and high school English classes. When I first went to the States, I couldn’t speak well, I couldn’t understand well. I couldn’t write anything. I had to read, like Huckleberry Finn, which was a total disaster for me, at that time!

Reading…or writing about it?

Reading.

Because there is a lot of slang there.

Ah.

Reading a page for English class took me, like, hours to translate and understand. That was high school. And in university I got much better, but still...you know, I had to read 100 pages by next week. You had to try to do it by skimming it and trying to, you know, read the….

…pulling out the…

…yeah, basically. You try to focus on the headings and main points and skim the rest and try to get the conclusion right. (laughs) I finally felt very comfortable taking classes and participating in classes when I went back to graduate school.

Oh really?

I really felt comfortable. At Georgetown I did fine, I got fine grades and everything. But, I never felt like, this is…like, this is, like I was….

You were out of your element – at that time.

Yeah. And I was trying to catch up and trying to do well.

Huh.

So when I went to graduate school I really enjoyed it. I felt like I had this freedom to…

Huh. And that was after you had been working, of course…

Yeah, so I was more mature as a person, too.

And more confident.

Confidence, exactly. And then writing at Reuters helped too.

Interesting, though, that the challenges that you’re talking about seem to be more about verbal communication and classroom culture than the actual mechanics and organization of writing.

Um. Actually I...I don’t know, even if I wrote in Japanese the same thing would happen…

“Same thing would happen” meaning…

You have to learn how to write well. You have to know how to structure your papers, how to write well.

There’s a lot of research on cross-cultural rhetoric, especially studies that compare Japanese rhetoric to Western rhetoric, that have found that Western writers follow what’s called an “inverted pyramid” organizational style, meaning that they start by stating a main idea, in the case of a paragraph, or a thesis statement, in the case of an extended essay, and follow it with details and examples that illustrate that main idea. Japanese rhetoric, by contrast, follows a pyramidal style in which writers give a number of details and examples and then end with the main idea. These are obviously two very different approaches. Have you found this to be true and, if so, was it a challenge for you to switch to a different organizational style?

I think…maybe no. Because I went to high school in the States and I just kind of jumped to the inverted pyramid style. I got trained there. When I read Japanese magazines and newspapers I notice the differences. In junior high school I had to write papers with Japanese rules, but not as much. It was more about memorizing and taking exams than writing papers.

Without ever having been trained in the so-called Japanese pyramidal style to begin with.

Exactly. So I think that probably is one reason I don’t find it as challenging as other people may have. If I had gone through university education here and then went to school over there, maybe that would have been a huge issue.

Whereas, as it turned out, the schooling you went through in Japan, you were getting that pyramidal style, but through reading. So it was more through osmosis.

Right. Exactly.

Interesting.

I feel more comfortable working in the inverted pyramid style after having worked at Reuters. Having done the graduate program at Johns Hopkins not only expanded but deepened my knowledge about economics. I also did a Southeast Asian studies program. Part of the reason is because I’m very fascinated by the region and want to live there at some point. So…I really enjoyed learning about that. And, especially, I’m writing about economics, and international economics courses have helped me understand what’s behind the scenes when I talk to economists. I can understand better why they say certain things.

You have a wider view.

And more confidence in myself to go talk to people. I now have friends everywhere – Southeast Asia, the U.S., and that’s a great asset.

Yes, absolutely.

ESL Writers Forum

July 2008

July 12, 2008

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Japanese Journalist's ESL Odyssey

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